OOC // Fixing AoU

[dayswithoutincident]

So, Age of Ultron! A bunch of us really hated it!

I suggested that we maybe rewrite it and play it as a big plot IG, and there seems to be some interest, so let's go for it!

I think that with our busy lives and the slowness of the game overall it's best if we have a strong outline with steps laid out so that everyone knows what to expect and what they're responsible for. I'm willing to do the organizational part and put everything together into a story that actually makes sense, but everyone needs to throw lots of ideas out first and brainstorm.

I think it's safe to say that this will happen through a specific door, and that some or all involved might get stuck on the other side for the duration. That way, the plot is forced to move forward, but it doesn't screw with whatever your personal version of the MCU is unless you want it to.

We probably also ought to discuss whether to limit it to MCU movie characters, or Marvel characters more broadly, or any game characters at all. I personally don't mind non-MCU characters as long as it makes sense and doesn't feel tacked on, but I'm not married to that opinion. There's definitely an argument to be made for simplicity.

So yeah, let me know your thoughts and story ideas both broad and specific!

Comments

[iron_y]

I don't mind non-MCU characters, whether Marvel or anyone else, the only possible problem I can see is that it would make plotting more complicated if anyone can come in and influence the plot. But I guess that's your look-out :)

So, since Tony drives a lot of the A-plot of the movie, I guess I'll start off by saying that I don't actually hate the plot as it relates to Tony. I don't necessarily think it was well done in the details, but in general, Tony goes big, screws up, tries to fix it -- totally in character for Tony. There are things I wouldn't mind changing, details I wouldn't mind tweaking all over the place... But in terms of the main outline, I'm fine keeping it or scrapping it, whatever works best for others.

(The main thing that I'd really need to tweak in terms of Tony's plot is that there's no indication in the new movie that Tony blew up all his suits at the end of IM3, and my Tony does come from after that point, so I'm pretty confused about that in a continuity sense and for roleplaying purposes would need to do something about that.)

The one rather big idea I'd have about rewriting AoU is that the whole mind-magic thing was pretty vague and hard to understand what was going on in this movie (unlike in the previous movie, where it was pretty clear exactly when Clint was under the influence, so to speak, and when he wasn't).

Lacking a Wanda in game at the moment to clarify all the questions I have... I wonder if we want to include the twins in our rewrite. I mean, I think they're cool characters, but if no one is playing them... Or if keeping the twins, then I'd really like to have some consensus about the mind magic. How does everyone else feel about mind magic, how do you think it actually works, etc.?

I do like Tony's motivation being fear for others, fear of aliens, etc., but I'd also be interested in exploring the idea that there could have been some actual threat when he creates Ultron? Because I don't know, somehow I find "mind magic made him do it" just a bit unsatisfying, especially since there's never any actual resolution to the mind magic plot.

Maybe...they find the Hydra guy negotiating with aliens in his fortress? Maybe some threat from a previous movie recurs? Or maybe...hmm, okay, does it count as rewriting Ultron if Tony's motivation comes from the game, i.e. the nexus sending him through a bunch of AUs in a row without him realizing that they're all AUs, and getting confused and desperate (I would need to think about this more, but I think it could work)? Because that idea makes me laugh a bit, but taken seriously it's something I'd be interested in doing, and it's sort of like mind-magic only real.

Oh, and the other thing is that I'd like to keep my same Tony, at least more or less... I don't know if this is possible, but it's something I'd like. The problem is that Tony doesn't really care about the nexus / what happens in other universes, and I like continuity. I want to be able to use this somehow in the future, so I don't want Tony to forget, and ideally I don't want Tony to be someone else for the duration (if/when that ever happens, it's going to be a very big deal, and I'd prefer not to use it up on this). So in terms of door shenanigans, I'd prefer it if I could drop my Tony in at some point during the non-stop action part, so that he doesn't have a lot of time to notice that he's in a different universe before he gets invested.

(And I'd also like the fact that he's in a different universe than he thinks to matter at some point...though quite frankly, since Age of Ultron doesn't do much with Thor2 or Cap2 continuity that I can recall, and neither of them have happened for Tony either, I'm really not sure what, unless it's something that someone else brings into this.)

Anyway, those are my main thoughts. Hope that wasn't too much!

Also, just to note, I'm not all that good at roleplaying to plan, so if we start off with a plan, I'm probably only going to want to actually play the things that aren't already pre-determined. But I'm sure there will be plenty of those!

[iron_y]

And having said that, I think should also mention (though it might be obvious) that I didn't actually hate the movie as a whole either, though I can understand why it could be hated.

I just really like rewriting things. I am, in fact, ridiculously fond of rewriting/replotting things.

So while I saw "rewrite" and couldn't resist, I may be way off base here, and if hating/fixing the movie is completely central to everything you want to do (I think I'm more into adapting/remixing with a side of fixing), I'll be happy to bow out and leave you to it. No worries.

[dayswithoutincident]

I don't think you're off base at all, and I think there's enough flexibility in the bones of the story that each person can decide how much they want to change for their own character. The basics are strong, I think.

I agree about the twins, they didn't feel at all necessary to the plot to me (and I mean that as apart from the problematic aspect of their heritage being erased, which is a whole other ball of wax), and it's like you said, that Wanda's influence being the impetus felt flimsy and unnecessary. I feel like you/we can easily find other motivations.

Of course, we never saw what she put in Bruce's head, so I'm in a more flexible position with that, I guess.

[iron_y]

Yeah, the biggest problem structurally might have been just overcrowding of the narrative.

I'm not familiar with the comics, so I can't really comment on that ball of wax. Maybe just as well.

Well, if it's a rewrite, everyone's in a flexible position :) So what would you be looking to change or to get out of this plot in terms of Bruce?

[dayswithoutincident]

I actually don't have a lot that I specifically want to get out of a rewrite, apart from Bruce being more in character -- I just don't see him blindly following Tony's lead when he knows what a truly bad idea it is for them to tap into that alien tech for Ultron, even if the science is exciting. His entire schtick is about how his life was ruined because he wasn't more circumspect, thus making him righteously paranoid. And, of course, I want to avoid the entire Nat business.

[iron_y]

Ha, yeah, Bruce the pushover was one of the things I eyed a bit askance in the movie.

Okay, this is awkward, but because of personal reasons that have nothing to do with this discussion, I'm going to bow out of the rewrite project. I don't know if I need to say this, because, well, doors, but please feel free to NPC Tony any way you want/need.

[captain_rogers]

As much as I'm for Falcon and War Machine becoming a part in the Avengers (and as much as Steve's for it), I have no plans to update Steve with the new movie and likely won't until Cap 3 comes out with the Russos at the helm.

I don't think that we necessarily have to pick back up the plot of Age of Ultron as much as find our own way once we rough out a plot skeleton to build on. The idea of using non-MCU but still Marvel characters definitely has an appeal, as we are not limited like the movie-verse to the issues regarding contracts and ownership. As large a cast as we already have, I don't think we really need any characters from outside what exists in their comics 'verse (I mean, technically Baymax even exists in the same universe, just in some vague-ish future setting of it).

I would like to see more what's holding the Avengers together, beyond an immediate threat, although they do best when given a common enemy to fight against. Definitely more continuation of the plotlines in their individual 'verses/dealing what happened within the timelines of the others. Tony's home in Malibu was destroyed and him possibly dead. Natasha's cover is blown wide and she has to learn who she is outside of SHIELD's borders. Hawkeye got his brain scrambled by Loki like an egg. Steve still doesn't know who he is outside the role of soldier, and his focus will remain for the most part on attempting to bring Bucky back into the world (although he'd never shirk his Cap duties). Thor's set down his duties in ruling Asgard to connect more to our world and learn who he is outside of being a prince. Hulk...really needs to not bleed into soda bottles, dude. That's not safe.

[dayswithoutincident]

I think that addressing the questions still unanswered is probably a major motivator for some of us in trying to find a better story. I do think that Ultron as a character is good, there was just so much else that built up around the concept that was super weak or problematic. There's stuff we can work with there, in the bones. So maybe we take the basic Ultron concept and find a way to answer all those questions we have on that framework.

[captain_rogers]

We can fix it! We have the technology!

[almightythor]

I like the idea of our current Avengers cast trying to right a wrong and having it blow up in their face. Does that have to be Ultron? Not necessarily. Tony and Thor have a thread going where they're going to try to trick Asgard into beefing up security and we could tie that into a larger plot where basically they all try to change the future to keep bad shit from happening, if you like.

Also if we did need Wanda for a temp plot, I could play her.